The 2023 – NCERT Controversy and the Left –all-out attack in the name of secularism, science and pedagogy – 250 signatories letter shot! (2)

The 2023 – NCERT Controversy and the Left –all-out attack in the name of secularism, science and pedagogy – 250 signatories letter shot! (2)

What Jamia Milia Islamia to do with NCERT?: In addition to the external experts, the NCERT also held consultations with 16  CBSE-nominated schoolteachers from various disciplines, the minister’s reply suggested. This newspaper on Wednesday wrote to Saklani, the NCERT director, asking on what basis the experts had been selected for the consultations, and why the original writers were not consulted. Saklani did not respond to these two specific questions but said the expert committees had thoroughly examined the content and recommended removals uniformly (across subjects) “without any selective approach”. Neshat Quiser, a retired professor of sociology who taught at the Jamia Millia Islamia, told this newspaper: “I don’t know if the NCERT invited the scholars who wrote the sociology books while revising the existing books. It would have been good to have a lively academic discussion with them for a better understanding before the revisions were undertaken.” Yadav said that when these books were first written, the NCERT had subjected them to multiple layers of scrutiny. 

Who can decide about pedagogy and their burden – historians or school teachers?: There were chief advisers and a team of authors who were experts either on the subject or on pedagogy. The advisory committee for the textbooks in the social sciences was headed by the late Hari Vasudevan, then professor of history, Calcutta University. There was a national monitoring committee, co-chaired by eminent academics G.P. Deshpande and Mrinal Miri, that vetted all the textbooks for accuracy and appropriateness.  “Any revision of these books must go through a similar rigorous process,” Yadav said. While writing and approving the book Politics in India Since Independence, special caution was taken to ensure factual accuracy and political neutrality since it covered sensitive topics, Yadav said. The book was reviewed by leading scholars in the social sciences such as Sunil Khilnani, Mahesh Rangarajan and Ramachandra Guha before it went to the national monitoring committee.

Revision has been going on for many years: As for the NCERT giving no explanations for the individual deletions, Yadav contrasted it with the transparent way an expert committee had removed cartoons from a political science textbook a decade ago. In 2012, after a controversy had broken out over these cartoons — some of them deemed derogatory to Babasaheb Ambedkar — an expert committee was set up under Sukhadeo Thorat, then chairperson of the Indian Council of Social Science Research. Yadav said the committee had called the authors of the book, the advisers and a wide range of political scientists and sought their views. “We were called and gave our views even though Prof. Palshikar and I had already resigned as chief advisers. We disagreed with the committee, but the committee gave reasons for its recommendation for the deletion of certain cartoons,” Yadav said. “But during the repeated revisions these books underwent since 2014, we were never consulted.

The authors have no say about the syllabus, portions etc: As far as I can tell, none of the authors has been involved in this process. “We don’t know, for example, the reasons for dropping the content on the Gujarat riots while retaining the content on the anti-Sikh riots, or the reasons for dropping facts about the ban on the RSS after Mahatma Gandhi’s assassination.”[1] Rajmohan Gndhi condemned about the deletion of Gandhi[2]. Yadav said that textbooks should be open to correction if they contain factual inaccuracies or anything inappropriate. He wondered what reasons there could be for the latest deletions. “The best explanation can come from those who decided to delete them,” Palshikar said. This newspaper contacted some of the experts consulted for the revisions. Kadam declined comment. “We don’t have the mandate to go out in public, to the press,” he said. Bhatt, speaking on Saturday afternoon, said: “Call me after three days.” Khobung and Pandey did not answer phone calls and are yet to respond to emails.

The ‘histories’ are widely circulated today through WhatsApp and other social media applications: A group of historians has raised concerns over the NCERT’s move to delete certain topics from history books for CBSE students. In a statement on Friday, they said they were “appalled” by the NCERT’s decision to delete the topics, particularly for Class 12, and called the move “a matter of deep concern”. The signatories of the statement include Romila Thapar, Jayati Gosh, Mridula Mukherjee, Apoorvanada, Irfan Habib and Upinder Singh, among others[3]. The other signatories included professors from Delhi University (DU) and its affiliated colleges, Jawaharlal Nehru University (JNU), Jamia Millia Islamia, Aligarh Muslim University (AMU), and Ambedkar University, among others.”By reducing the study of history to such monolithic accounts, the ground is being prepared for pseudo-histories, especially of a communal and casteist variety, to hold sway. In any case, such ‘histories’ are widely circulated today through WhatsApp and other social media applications,” the historians said, alluding to an alleged attempt to insert politics in education[4]. As for at the propaganda is concerned, the Communists of all the categories cannot be beaten, as they have been the masters in such subject matter.

How the pedagogy of science and history differ?: The media has been biased in telling the truth, particularly, during the prevailing conditions. Here also, first the objection is given importance and circulated as main news. The clarification gien by the NCERT has not been given any importance[5] relegating to background. The details given in their wesite also have not been read by many[6]. Thus, the readers are made or forced to read the objection first and forgetting the accused and hearing to him / her. Thus, they are not bothered about, “audi alteram partem,” just try the target, accuse, make him accused and hang. No principles of natural justice etc., you can sit as a judge, a lawyer, witness and all, decide the case and pass judhgment also. Here, also the difference between “Science” and “history” can be noted. By reducing the syllabus, the teachers, professors or students are not so worried as overanxoys exhibited by the historians, who claim that they used to work with scientific temper and following scientific methodology.

Why the Left always carry out such propagandist attacks?: Without reading, many groups have also starting condemning and manufacturing news. Thus, evidently, they (media) continue to support their ideological friends, historians and history writers who continue to divide Indians on some reason. To cite one example, the whole fight of their acrimonious, spiteful and antagonistic attitude, verbose and arguments againt “Temple” has been tested at the Courts and proven wrong. Ironically, their own collegues have been censured by the Court for deposing and giving false evidences. Yet, they continue to suppress the facts and pose as saviours, protectors and redeemers of history, historiography, historiosophy, etc.  Now they are worried about the Schools text books, syllabus, burden, pedagogy etc. At the University and college levels, they could not produce students with discipline, decency and decorum. They could not inculcate any tinge of patriotism, nationalism and devotion to their own country, but, always take every chance to criticize, blame and abuse their own county, that too, at the cost of supporting the countries that harm India and Indians. Thoroghout the world, perhaps, only in India, Indians could talk ill of their country under the guise of freedom of thought, right, opinion and so on. With all these proven credentials, they want to interfere with schools, school syllabus, portions etc., Why cannot they concentrate with their academic activities? Why can not they teach their students properly and make them good, honest and faithful Indians?

© Vedaprakash

10-04-2023

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[1] Indian Express, Rajmohan Gandhi writes on textbook deletions: You can’t delete Gandhi’s truth, Written by Rajmohan Gandhi, Updated: April 8, 2023 16:59 IST.

[2] https://indianexpress.com/article/opinion/columns/rajmohan-gandhi-textbook-deletions-mahatma-gandhi-8542909/

[3] NDTV, “Histories Circulated On WhatsApp”: Historians On NCERT Textbook Move, India News, Reported by Saurabh Shukla, Edited by Anisha PrakashUpdated: April 08, 2023 9:40 pm IST

[4] https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/histories-circulated-on-whatsapp-historians-on-ncert-textbook-move-3931925

[5] List of Rationalised Content

•   List of Rationalised Content – Class 6
•   List of Rationalised Content – Class 7
•   List of Rationalised Content – Class 8
•   List of Rationalised Content – Class 9
•   List of Rationalised Content – Class 10
•   List of Rationalised Content – Class 11
•   List of Rationalised Content – Class 12

By clicking each, one can download the booklet and read the rationalization carried out in each subject for the respective classes.

[6] https://ncert.nic.in/rationalised-content.php

The 2023 – NCERT Controversy and the Left –all-out attack in the name of secularism, science and pedagogy! (1)

The 2023 – NCERT Controversy and the Left –all-out attack in the name of secularism, science and pedagogy! (1)

The Telegraph’s Editorial 10-04-2023: The Telegraph published the news and as well its editorial passing the judgment., “An exercise in ‘rationalisation’ should be pivoted on reason. Ironically, when it comes to ‘rationalising’ educational curriculum, the rationale often undermines reason[1]. The latest — the third instance in the last six years — tweaks to textbooks, mostly of history, political science and sociology, by the National Council of Educational Research and Training is a case in point[2]. The motive then is not rationalisation: it is modification and distortion. Such an intervention — encroachment — is not surprising. Independent India has been witness to the formulation of a cosy relationship between politics and pedagogy. The goal, evidently, is to exercise control over thought processes to bring about an ideological transition in a captive audience. A controlled — curbed — curriculum would lead to the stifling of curiosity and questioning. This intellectual retardation has the potential to damage democracy by churning out a generation of passive, unquestioning citizens. Political meddling with curriculum must be resisted from within institutions. India’s new generation must also be encouraged to tap into unprejudiced sources of knowledge — this, after all, is the age of information — to be alert to pedagogical imbalances.”

NCERT’s clarification: The Telegraph continued: However, the National Council of Educational Research and Training (NCERT) has denied any recent curriculum trimming and asserts that the syllabus was rationalised in June last year[3]. According to a note on the NCERT’s website, the COVID-19 pandemic necessitated a reduction in content load on students. The National Education Policy (NEP) 2020 also emphasises reducing content load and providing opportunities for experiential learning with a creative mindset[4]. As a result, the NCERT undertook the exercise to rationalize textbooks across all classes and subjects. The present edition of textbooks is a reformatted version after the changes, and the textbooks are rationalised textbooks that were rationalized for the session 2022-23 and will continue in 2023-24. Subjects were dropped during the rationalization due to content based on genres of literature, reducing curriculum load and exam stress, content that is easily accessible to students without teacher intervention, and content that is “irrelevant” in the present context. An official from the education ministry said the new curriculum framework under the NEP is still being worked out, and new textbooks according to the updated curriculum will only be introduced from the 2024 academic session.

The reasons for deleting have not been communicated to the original authors or the public: The Telegraph continued: The National Council of Educational Research and Training purged select content from textbooks of different subjects without consulting the original authors of the books, many of these authors have confirmed to The Telegraph[5]. The NCERT made the changes after consulting external experts, the majority of them schoolteachers[6]. However, the reasons for deleting the specific contents — for instance, chapters on the Mughals and the Gujarat riots from the Class XII history and political science textbooks, respectively — have not been communicated to the original authors or the public, claim the Telegraph. It is not known why such thngs should be informed to the public or the auhours. The authors write as per the directions of the NCERT. Had the auhors published the books, then, they may be informed by the publishers or rather, it is carried on as per the agreement. This newspaper’s efforts to elicit the specific reasons for the various deletions from the NCERT director and the external experts remained unfruitful, with some declining comment and others failing to respond, seeking time, or giving evasive answers.

The Telgraph knows the reason: Having made such comments, the Telegraph says, “The generic reason for the deletions — carried out last year — that the national academic body has given is the need to lighten the academic load on the pupils following the disruptions caused by the pandemic. However, several academics — including a few of the authors of the textbooks — have objected to the procedure followed by the NCERT to carry out the revisions, with some of them smelling a “political agenda” behind the changes. “It’s hard to avoid the impression that the so-called committees involved in the revision have rubber-stamped what they were told to do by the powers that be,” Yogendra Yadav, former senior fellow at the Centre for the Studies of Developing Societies (CSDS) and one of the authors of the now-revised political science textbooks for Classes IX to XII, told this newspaper.”

As usual the Left-Marxist-Communist historians protest: The Telegraph continued: Suhas Palshikar, former professor with Pune University who was chief adviser for the political science textbooks for Classes IX to XII along with Yadav, said: “There seems to be arbitrariness and a political agenda behind these deletions.” A statement issued on Saturday by over 300 eminent academics from history and other disciplines, too, confirmed that the deletions from the NCERT’s history textbooks were carried out without consulting the original authors. “Guided by a divisive and partisan agenda, the NCERT by selectively deleting several important themes from school textbooks is not only doing great disservice to the composite heritage of the Indian subcontinent but betraying the aspirations of the Indian masses,” the statement said. The signatories included historians Romila Thapar, Irfan Habib, Kumkum Roy, Mridula Mukherjee and Sucheta Mahajan.

Politicization and ideologization of history: The Telegraph continued: The NCERT has dropped content on the Gujarat riots, the ban on the RSS following Mahatma Gandhi’s assassination, references to Hindu extremists killing Gandhi, the “controversies regarding (the) Emergency”, among others, from the book Politics in India Since Independence, taught in Class XII. However, it has retained text on the anti-Sikh riots of 1984[7]. Content on Jawaharlal Nehru, the Mughals, the caste system and social discrimination has been drastically reduced from the textbooks of history, political science and sociology for various classes[8]. NCERT director Dinesh Prasad Saklani has said that content was shed from all books across classes and subjects, and that this was done “professionally” by subject experts.This newspaper has scrutinised the replies the government has made in Parliament on the subject, and obtained details of the experts associated with the textbook revision from a reply that junior education minister Annpurna Devi made in the Lok Sabha on July 18 last year. Nationalist Congress Party member Mohammed Faizal had sought details of the experts.#According to the reply, the external experts consulted for the revision of the history books were Umesh Kadam, professor of history, Centre for Historical Studies (CHS), Jawaharlal Nehru University; Archana Verma, associate professor of history at Hindu College, Delhi University (DU); and three postgraduate teachers from schools. There was one round of consultation.

So what the consultations decided to do?: The Telegraph continued: The history books for Classes VI to VIII and Classes IX to XII were written between 2006 and 2008 by two teams of subject experts with Neeladri Bhattacharya, then professor at CHS, as chief adviser. The team that wrote the books for Classes VI to VIII included writer and historian Ramachandra Guha, nine university or college teachers, an education activist and three schoolteachers. The authors’ team for the senior classes had 15 faculty members, a writer, an editor, two activists and three schoolteachers. #The external experts consulted for the revision of the political science textbooks were Vanthangpui Khobung, assistant professor, political science, Regional Institute of Education, Bhopal (an NCERT constituent); Maneesha Pandey, department of political science, Hindu College, DU; and two postgraduate schoolteachers. There were two rounds of consultations.

© Vedaprakash

10-04-2023

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[1] The Telegraph, Deep cuts: Editorial on key deletions from NCERT textbooks, The Editorial Board   |   Published 10.04.23, 06:07 AM.

[2] https://www.telegraphindia.com/opinion/deep-cuts-editorial-on-key-deletions-from-ncert-textbooks/cid/1928503

[3] India Today, NCERT syllabus rationalisation gives rise to fresh row | Topics removed and why the syllabus was cut down, India Today Education Desk, New Delhi, UPDATED: Apr 7, 2023 17:47 IST.

[4] https://www.indiatoday.in/education-today/news/story/ncert-syllabus-rationalisation-gives-rise-to-fresh-row-topics-removed-and-why-the-syllabus-was-cut-down-2356572-2023-04-06

[5] The Telegraph, Authors kept in dark on text purge, Basant Kumar Mohanty   |   New Delhi   |   Published 10.04.23, 05:12 AM.

[6] https://www.telegraphindia.com/india/authors-kept-in-dark-on-text-purge/cid/1928485

[7] LiveMint, Historians ‘appalled’ by NCERT trying to make history textbooks ‘one-sided’, Sounak Mukhopadhyay,,Updated: 09 Apr 2023, 08:12 AM IST

[8] https://www.livemint.com/news/india/historians-appalled-by-ncert-trying-to-make-history-textbooks-onesided-11681006405891.html

“Glimpses of Srimad Bhagavatam” – National seminar held at Vijayawada on October 14th and 15th, 2017.

“Glimpses of Srimad Bhagavatam” – National seminar held at Vijayawada on October 14^th and 15^th, 2017.

“Glimpses of Srimad Bhagavatam” – National seminar held at Vijayawada: Bharatiya Itihasa Sankalana Samiti[1](hereinafter mentioned as BISS), Andhra Pradesh conducted two National Seminars on Ramayanam – Historicity and Maha Bharatam – Historicity in 2013 and 2015 in Ongole and Rajamundhry respectively.  In 2017, the BISS conducted a national seminar at Vijayawada on October 14^th and 15^th on “Glimpses of Srimad Bhagavatam”. Now that “Historicity” was dropped might be noted. The venue was “Haindavi” Bhavan, Street besides Lotus Land Mark[2], Ramalingeswara Peta, Vijayawada-3. Actually, it is in Sector-5, and the location is known as “near Ice Factory”. Outstation delegates had some difficulty to reach the venue. Incidentally, the multi-storied building was built, completed and inaugurated last year[3]. Sri Siddheswarananda Bharati Swamy of Sri Siddheswari Peetham (Tamil Nadu) and Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS) All India Organising Secretary Dattatreya Hosabale inaugurated the RSS’s regional office ‘Hyndavi’ at Ayodhya Nagar here on August 5^th, 2016 (Thursday)[4].

The seminar hall has been equipped with Power point and other provisions. The organizers had made good arrangements – food, accommodation etc., for the delegates. Sri Koti Lakshmana Rao, secretary, BISS has been instrumental in bringing different researchers, scholars and others together.

Theme of the Seminar: Research Papers were received from scholars, Research Students and people who were interested in History of ancient India / Bharat and its culture, tradition, heritage and civilization. The organizers expressed in their circular specifically that the Samiti desired that the main focus of the presentations in the seminar should be on historical, geographical, political, social, and cultural as well as Dharmic and ethical perspectives. They suggested the following topics in the context:

1.       Viswa srushti 2.      Propositions on Dharma 3.      Astronomical perspectives 4.      Geographical references 5.      Rivers, Mountains, Forests 6.      Piligrimages 7.      Life style of forest dwellers, common people & kings (rulers) 8.     Status & significance of Women.

9.      Systems of Education 10.  Customs & Rituals 11.   Sculpture, Architecture & Fine Arts 12.  Kings, kingdoms, Royal dynasties, 13.  State craft & politics, Systems of State And Governance 14.  Sages, establishments and their influence 15.   Upakhyanas and their influence etc., 16.  Other related topic also may be considered.

About 40 papers were presented on the topics suggested, but overlapping. Most of the papers delved upon the devotional, descriptive, narrative, legendary aspects and discourses of Bhagawatham. Perhaps, only one paper delved upon the historical perspective, which touched upon the “Archaeological Evidences for the existence of “Historical Krishna”. In the present-day context, as ideology has been working at the Universities, schools and all other academic institutions and forums, it could be answered and countered only by ideology and not by devotional discourses. Of course, it is required and may be mandatory also at earlier stages of curriculum, hitherto followed as “Moral period / class” provided till 1970s. The “Moral period” was removed and of course, the degradation of sacademics could be noted thereafter in different aspects.

Critical edition of Bhagawatam has to be brought out: Critical editions of Ramayana and Mahabharat have been prepared and published by the Baroda Oriental Rearch Institute and Bhandarkar Oriental Rearch Institute respectively[5]. Similarly, critical edition of Bhagawatapurana should be published, so that researchers, scholars and students could conduct their research in the historical perspective. Approaching Bhagawatam in Sanskrit and other regional languages show how the work had been so popular and common among the common people for 2000 years. Though, the narrative, legendary and mythical details vary, the core of the subject matter remains intact and specific. The study / process of manuscripts to determine the original or most authoritative form of a text, especially of a piece of literature and thus arriving at an acceptable version and publication of it is known as “critical edition”. In Literary criticism it is stressing close reading and detailed analysis of a particular text. In such determination of determining the original or most authoritative form of a text, all the available manuscripts are subjected to study. Notably, in “India”(pre-colonial, pre-Mohammedan) thousands and millions of manuscripts had been available, as they were nothing but just like present-day printed books. In spite of the taking away, looting and burning libraries of temples, mutts and Universities, still millions of manuscript are available in thousands of archives, libraries – prove the fact. Perhaps, no other literature of any nation, language or society has been existing in this manner. Therefore, the variance found in Indian literature has been unique, interpolations incidental (other than internal nature of Jains, Buddhists etc) and differences inadvertent. Thus, a critical edition can be prepared.

The hall where seminar was held.

Limited audience – LHS view.

Limited audience – RHS view.

Inaguration of the seminar by lighting a lamp.

Scholars presenting papers.

Researchers presenting papers.

Demythologization in Indian context: In Indian historiographical context, much of “demythologization” is also required. Demythologization as a hermeneutic approach to religious texts seeks to separate cosmological and historic claims from philosophical, ethical and theological teachings. Rudolf Bultmann (1884-1976) introduced the term demythologization (in German: Entmythologisierung) in this context[6]. It is to provide an explanation of something, or to present something, in a way that removes any mystery surrounding it. Here, actually, history has been mythologized to reach all and common people with easy understanding. The following have been generally noted as feature of mythologization of different aspects and subjects of humanity:

1. Deification of personalities raising them to Godhead and God.
2. Attributing miracles, grand feats, great exploitation, controlling nature etc.
3. Recording Natural disasters (floods, volcanic eruptions, earth-quakes, submergence of land mass and other land disturbances) in their own fashion of divine scourge, punishment of God and so on.
4. Good would always prevail over Bad, evil, injustice etc.
5. “Cakravarti-kshetra” i.e, a king ruling vast area with unlimited or traditional boundaries (Himalsyas in the north, Kanyakumari / ocean in the south, Eastern Ocean in the east and the western ocean in the west)[7].
6. Concept of dwelling land, continent changing from island (Jambudwipam, Navalanthivu) to the above boundaries.
7. Movement of asterisms, planets etc., and their attribution to great personalities and gods.
8. Synchronization of rites, festivals and celebrations with days, weeks, 15-days, 30-days, year and so on (Lunar calendar).
9. Attribution of cyclic periods, growth of plants and trees, flowers and fruits top a particular god or Goddess.
10. Existence of personalities for many years – 100, 1,000 etc., denoting existence of such ashrams, mutt etc.

Second day seminar – starting with a prayer.

Methodology adopted and adapted by the Puranic writers – a way of historiography: They are nothing but Puranas and they were updated during the course of time many times. The updating is nothing but adding details upto the date of updating, thus, if one Purana was uptated in 1500 CE, it would contain details upto 1500 CE from the beginning. Revising, renewing and modernizing Puranas was considered as imortant in those days. All the above topics would havealso been updated depending upon the acumen of the updating experts. However, reading such revised editions of Puranas (in manuscript forms), the wesern researchers and European colonial history writers presumed that such and such Purana was written in 1500 CE instead of 300 BCE, 500 BCE or even 1000 BCE. The Jaina[8] and Buddhists[9] had resorted to update in their own fashion by including their affairs and thus, they could bee seen in the manuscripts of Ramayana and Mahabharat also. But, no historian would accept that the dates of Jainism and Buddhism could go back to those periods. Though, the date of Ramayana has been entangled with “Yuga” calculations, the date of Mahabharat has been fixed to c.3102 BCE[10].

© Vedaprakash

16-10-2017

The paper presenters were given certificates.

This lady-researcher from Rastriya Sanskrit Vidhyapit, Tirupati presented paper in Sanskrit.

This researcher from Rastriya Sanskrit Vidhyapit, Tirupati also presented paper in Sanskrit.  His way of presentaion, expression and body language had been so articulative conveying mesage to the listeners.

[1] A society for collection of data for history writing for Bharat, that is India.

[2] This created confusion for auto drivers and they took the coming delegates in opposite direction and the reaching the venue.

[3] The Hindu, RSS’s regional office ‘Hyndavi’ inaugurated, Vijayawada, August, 05, 2016 00:00 IST; Updated. August, 05, 2016 06:06 IST

[4] http://www.thehindu.com/todays-paper/tp-national/tp-andhrapradesh/RSS%E2%80%99s-regional-office-%E2%80%98Hyndavi%E2%80%99-inaugurated/article14552939.ece

[5] Critical edition is an authorized sort of version of Itihasa, after going through available thousands of manuscripts by hundreds of Pundits, scholars, historians etc., separating interpolated verses and arriving at acceptable version.

[6] Though, he used in the biblical context, in India, we can use in Indian context. For us, the Puranic writers have themselves have shown the methodology of mythologization and demythologization of history for the different groups of audience.

[7] D. C. Sircar pointed out in his book on epigraphy.

[8] Jains created 24-tirtankaras and made them existing in Ramayana and Mahabharat periods.

[9] Buddhists had created the concept of “Adi Buddha” existing in every yuga.

[10] This has traditional date but recorded in inscriptions and now proven by atronomical and planetary pisition software. Incidentally, this date has been associated with – starting of Kaliyuga, subnergence of Dwaraka, Niryana of Krishna, and other events.

How is that Indians still do not know as to “Good Friday” is “Good” or “Bad” or that day is for mourning or celebration?

How is that Indians still do not know as to “Good Friday” is “Good” or “Bad” or that day is for mourning or celebration?

Business people want to do business on holidays: In a week filled with public holidays including Holi, Good Friday and Easter [(25-03-2016 (Friday), 26-03-2016 (Saturday) and 27-03-2016 (Sunday)], e-commerce sites have tried to capitalise on the four-day weekend by luring shoppers with heavy discounts[1]. It is quite natural thay business people want to do business on holidays! Therefore, the use of term ‘good Friday’ in a promotional campaign by E-commerce firm Snapdeal on Good Friday, a day observed to commemorate the crucifixion of Jesus Christ, triggered a row, after which the company apologised[2], as reported by the Indian press is intriguing. It added the feason that the content of the promotions did not go down well with members of the Christian community, as despite its name, Good Friday is not a day of celebration. Instead, it is the day on which Christians commemorate the crucifixion and death of Jesus Christ. It is a day of fasting and penance for the community. It is in this context that some Christians felt that the advertisements put out by Snapdeal and Myntra were in bad taste[3]. Though, these media-guys suddenly became so “christian” to defend christians had not been intelligent enough to poin out the faux pas. Ironically, the so-called intelligent or secular Indian media did not point out when the ads were put on.

Snapdeal and Myntra offers on Good Friday: Issuing an (sic) statement, the e-tailer said: “We regret the tag line used. It is an error on our part”. “We extend our sincere apologies to all whose feelings we may have hurt inadvertently. We will work to ensure that something like this never happens again,” said a Snapdeal spokes person[4]. To cash in on the extended weekends due to Holi and Good Friday, Snapdeal had sent promotional e-mails to its customers with a subject line “It’s a really really good Friday|Flat 40% Off”[5]. Another retailer Myntra also reportedly run a similar promotional campaign offering steep discounts ranging from 50 per cent to 80 per cent to its buyers on the day[6]. Despite several efforts, Myntra company officials could not be reached for comments. However, a section of people (Christians) felt offended to this as Good Friday is not a day of celebration.

It (the objection of Christians) started with Goa: “I was appalled when I got the app notification from Myntra,” said Fernando Monte Da Silva, a journalist from Panjim in Goa. “I was shocked at the ignorance and insensitivity on display.” Silva said the prefix “Good” often misleads people into thinking it is a day for celebration. There are several theories surrounding the etymology of Good Friday, one of them being that the day is “good” because Christ showed his love for mankind by dying for their sins. However, Silva said this confusion could not be used an excuse in the case. “I had a professor who wished me for Good Friday, but that is an honest mistake,” said Silva. “In a company as big as Myntra, I would assume that there would be levels of scrutiny before such content is (are) put out. Ignorance is one thing, but when you’re using it as a promo to generate revenue, that’s just taking it a tad too far.” Silva shared a screenshot of the alert on his Facebook page and triggered a debate over whether sheer ignorance was at play or whether the content writers had pushed the boundaries of creativity. Thus, this news was also created out of Twitter only!

While few BJP leaders were wrong, Modi was correct on “Good Friday”: The faux pas occurred on a day when two senior BJP leaders were today left embarrassed after they set Twitter abuzz with criticism by “wishing happiness” on the occasion of Good Friday. After all when the business people with all nuances could not know “Good Friday” is “bad”, how the poor BJP leaders know. Any way, Modi tweeteed, “Good Friday is a day of prayer & a day to remember the noble, pious & compassionate thoughts of Jesus Christ, that touched many lives”! Any way, these Hindutwa guys have not been so sophisticated as the crooked, atheist and secular Karunanidhi who wishes and weeps dramatically for all non-Hindu festivals or mournings without fail, even if they forget.

Tech In Asia ‘s campaign against campaign:  Eye-popping sales and deals of the week are pretty standard marketing gimmicks for retailers across the world, online or offline[7], thus noted one Techniasia. In India, where ecommerce is seeing breakneck growth, taking up any opportunity to promote sales has become a pretty standard deal. There are Diwali sales, Christmas deals, regional celebrations and in true American fashion, even back to school campaigns. However, it has failed to record that these campaigners too had gone in “American fashion” but, took it as “Black Friday”! Over the weekend, two Indian biggies – Snapdeal and Myntra, owned by Flipkart – pushed the envelope so far, it all fell apart. They used Good Friday, the day observed to commemorate the crucifixion of Jesus Christ, as promotional material. Not surprisingly, customers lashed out online, thus, Techniasia continued its big lie, as if “all customers” indulged in such lashing out. “We know it’s a Good Friday when you get 50-80 percent off,” said a Myntra campaign[8]. Snapdeal went along similar lines, saying it was a “really really good Friday,” peddling a flat forty percent off campaign on the website. Snapdeal has since apologized for the faux pas, but Myntra just told Tech In Asia it had no comments i.e, they could not be reached[9].

Snapdeal’s Arvind confessed that they were ignorant about Good Friday!: That’s telling, given how a marketing campaign in these companies would have to be vetted and approved by an entire team before it went live, and couldn’t simply be a slip by one person. “There is pressure of increasing sales on all retailers, and it’s not just on online ones. But this purely a reflection of the ineptness of the marketing department at these companies,” chairman of management consulting firm TechnopakAdvisors told Tech in Asia. However, most industry watchers said this wouldn’t make a lasting dent on either company’s brand image. India is a secular country, but about 80 percent of its population is Hindu. Industry experts say the blunder may have been lost on a number of customers, who themselves may not be well acquainted with the significance of the day of mourning. “This is ignorance, but this won’t hurt the companies in the long run. When it comes to brand image, I don’t think customers will remember for too long,” Arvind said.

Black Friday and Good Friday in American way: BlacThe business people obviously confused with “Black Friday” (sales and shopping) with “Good Friday”! Thanksgiving Day in the United States (the fourth Thursday of November). Since 1932, it has been regarded as the beginning of the Christmas shopping season in the US, and most major retailers open very early (and more recently during overnight hours) and offer promotional sales. Black Friday is not an official holiday, but California and some other states observe “The Day After Thanksgiving” as a holiday for state government employees, sometimes in lieu of another federal holiday such as Columbus Day[10]. Many non-retail employees and schools have both Thanksgiving and the following Friday off, which, along with the following regular weekend, makes it a four-day weekend, thereby increasing the number of potential shoppers. It has routinely been the busiest shopping day of the year since 2005[11].

Has Christianity and Christ failed in India?: From Snapdeal to Myntra amd politicians do not know about the significance of “Good Friday”, how common people of India know? For example, how many of Indian Christians, who were converted from Hindu religion really know about it mourn? The missionaries had been fooling the heathen Indians, idolatrous Hindus and what not for the last 300 years, but, yet, the “enlightened” converted Christians could not understand the theology of Good Friday and Easter. This clearly proves the religious fraud, failure of Christianity and Christ and utter uselessness of their theology. Why then thousands of missionaries of A to Z denominations come here, spent millions and loot millions to foll Indians and also fool themselves. Let them take a relook at themselves, as the commericial companies did blunder.

© Vedapraksh

29-03-2016

[1] Scroll.in, ‘It’s a really really good Friday’: Myntra, Snapdeal irk Christians with ‘insensitive’ ads, by Scroll Staff, Published Mar 25, 2016 · 08:10 pm.   Updated Mar 25, 2016 · 08:11 pm.

[2] The Financial express, Ecommerce: Snapdeal, Myntra eat humble pie on Good Friday sales, By: PTI | New Delhi | March 25, 2016 11:25 PM

[3] http://scroll.in/article/805679/its-a-really-really-good-friday-myntra-snapdeal-irk-christians-with-insensitive-ads

[4] Hindusthan Times, Snapdeal’s faux pas: Good Friday sales tagline backfires, PTI, New Delhi, Updated: Mar 27, 2016 02:39 IST.

[5] http://www.financialexpress.com/article/industry/companies/ecommerce-snapdeal-myntra-eat-humble-pie-on-good-friday-sales/229613/

[6] http://www.dnaindia.com/money/report-snapdeal-apologises-for-using-really-really-good-friday-as-tag-line-for-sale-2194084

[7] Techinasia, Two of India’s biggest startups really missed the mark on Good Friday, Nivedita Bhattacharjee, 6:55 PM on Mar 28, 2016

[8] https://www.techinasia.com/myntra-snapdeal-good-friday

[9] http://www.hindustantimes.com/business/snapdeal-s-faux-pas-good-friday-sales-tagline-backfires/story-gSgHhoVtFzmIGxznabQaTO.html

[10]  “Pima County in Arizona Replaces Columbus Day with Black Friday”. BestBlackFriday.com. August 7, 2013.

[11] International Council of Shopping Centers.“Holiday Watch: Media Guide 2006 Holiday Facts and Figure”.; ShopperTrak, Press Release,ShopperTrak Reports Positive Response to Early Holiday Promotions Boosts Projections for 2010 Holiday Season at the Wayback Machine (archived November 29, 2010) (November 16, 2010).

Why the priest of Gunadala Mary Matha Church is involved in sexploitation and it is reported selectively?

Why the priest of Gunadala Mary Matha Church is involved in sexploitation and it is reported selectively?

Gunadala Mary Matha Church priest involved in sexual exploitation: The management of a Catholic church at Gunadala Mary Matha Church here, which landed in a major controversy following charges of sexual misconduct of a priest, reportedly began inquiry into the episode[1]. “The Times of India” mentions its name, whereas, “The Hindu” does not mention the name of the church involved. The roots of this case seem to be deep as the city police reportedly had to take 11 members into police custody for interrogation as on Saturday 12-03-2016[2]. The religious head had paid ransom to a gang[3]. Not satisfied with the payment, the gang demanded more money and threatened the victim, who approached the police. The priest is understood to have told the police that he paid more than Rs. 1 crore to the gang[4]. He alleged the extortionists, who befriended him, morphed his image in a pornographic film and collected money from him. “It is a fact that a gang blackmailed the religious head and extorted huge money from him. We are investigating the case from all angles,” said City Police Commissioner D. Gautam Sawang.

The involved priest has already been accused of misappropriation of funds etc: However, the church management is inquiring into the behaviour of the religious head and his source of income. It was alleged that a portion of the funds allocated to the shrine and for the poor were misused by him. The City Task Force police collected details of the gang from the priest and rounded up many of the accused. Police are investigating why the religious head was targeted, how he was trapped and the mode of payment made to the extortion gang. Investigation officers are trying to find out whether the pornographic film was original or morphed, if so where the film was shot and the persons involved in the act, including the woman. Police collected the call data of the gangsters and are collecting scientific evidence in the case. The media has been very selective in reporting the facts, as evidently, a Catholic priest has been involved.

 

The Church management is planning to replace the priest after conducting an inquiry: It is said that a follower of the religious head shared sensitive information about the priest, including his financial standing, with the gang which lured him on the pretext of offering a party a few months ago. Later, they started blackmailing him. The role of some media persons came to the fore as they took duplicate copies of the film and collected money from the priest for not telecasting his illegal activities in the news channels. “The extortion gang committed similar offences in other places in the State. We are trying to find out whether the media personnel and advocates whose phone numbers were surfaced in the call data recordings were part of the gang?” an investigation officer told The Hindu . It is learnt that the church management is planning to replace the priest after conducting an inquiry[5]. The heads of the church reportedly sought clarification from the priest on the allegations. However, nothing has been reported the version of the accused priest in the case. In fact, his name itself is not revealed.

July 2015 incidence of sexual harassment a girl by three boys in Gunadala: In and around the Mary Matha Church, Gunadala, there have been several incidences of sexual abuses of girls as selectively reported by the media. A minor girl was reportedly subjected to sexual abuse by five youths at Bethleham Colony in Gunadala[6]. The incident came to light on Saturday. Machavaram police took three of the accused into custody, and registered a case under section 376 of the IPC. A 15-year-old girl, resident of Carmel Nagar in Gunadala, went to the Mary Matha Church along with her boyfriend. He and the four other accused are alleged to have drugged her, took her to a room in Bethleham Colony and sexually abused her for two days. Three of the accused finally dropped the girl in a semi-conscious state at her home in Carmel Nagar on July 17.2015. Her mother, employed as a sweeper by the Vijayawada Municipal Corporation (VMC), had by then lodged a complaint with police. She suspected the involvement of the victim’s boyfriend and his associates. The victim is a class VII dropout. Her boyfriend works at a mobile phone repair shop in Gundala. The police took her boyfriend and two of his associates into custody. They are also on the lookout for the others[7].

Bonga Suresh, priest involved in sexual scandal: Bonga Suresh, a pastor of a Church / parish RCM priest in Krishna district continuously harassed a woman sexually. The video gives full details, as to how he has been sexploiting the girls there. Obviously, the young woman had been threatened as it would affect the image of the church and hence she narrated her sexploitation in limited terms, but exposing the pastor. At one stage,, she was even forced to commit suicide. In fact, she informed the Bishop, but, he refused to entertain her plea, obviously for the honour of the church[8]. Though, the Church denomination is not mentioned, the involvement, sexploitation etc., are exposed thoroughly.

Pornography was discussed during the youth Christian convention, October 2015: In the National Youth Conference of the Assemblies of God in Hyderabad during October 23-25, 2012, Duke Jeyaraj talked about perils of pornography and bust the biggest excuse people use to watch porn which is, “I am watching porn to learn sex technique which I will only use inside of marriage.” Other hot topics were covered brilliantly by other experts and I thank God for each one of them[9]. Whether, it was negative suggestion or otherwise, the very discussion would lead to young people differently. Particularly, when the Indian church has been rocked by thousands of sex, rape and sexploitation cases, why such things are encouraged is not known.

The biased, prejudiced and partial reporting of the media: As many happenings have been taking place involving religious heads in different parts of India and such events are reported, commented upon and viewed by the leading TV-channels, media experts and journalists in not only print and electronic media, but also in social network, the bias in their responses is noted very easily. Much hue and cry has been made about the “World Cultural Festival” conducted on the banks of Yamuna from March 11^th to 13^th 2016. The private visit of temples in Andhra by Nityananda has been sensationalised by the media, meticulously repeating his 2010 incidence and all. But, a Christian priest has been involved, the way the media reports can be noted. In spite of pornography is involved, the media wants to play down and suppress the facts. It is just like the JNU porn CD issue. Here also CDs are in circulation, but, no TV channel broadcast as done in Nityananda case, why? Who imposes such restrictions? Why such partiality comes into play? Is Nityananda been different from Joseph Palanivel Jeyapaul or any other rapist, child rapist or paedophile? When he has been reinstated[10], the same media experts kept silence, they did not respond the way they do in facebook and twitter.

© Vedaprakash

14-03-2016

[1]  The times of India, Catholic priest case: 11 persons taken into custody, Phanindra Papasani | TNN | Mar 13, 2016, 12.36 AM IST.

[2] http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/vijayawada/Catholic-priest-case-11-persons-taken-into-custody/articleshow/51376906.cms

[3] The Hindu, Priest, blackmailed by gang, paid hefty amount, says CP, by Rajulapudi srinivas, Vijayawada, March.14, 2016; Updated: March 14, 2016 05:46 IST.

[4] http://www.thehindu.com/news/cities/Vijayawada/priest-blackmailed-by-gang-paid-hefty-amount-says-cp/article8351138.ece

[5] http://www.nyoooz.com/vijayawada/389661/priest-blackmailed-by-gang-paid-hefty-amount-says-cp

[6] The times of India, Minor girl in Vijaywada sexually abused; 3 held, TNN | Jul 19, 2015, 02.34 PM IST

[7] http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/vijayawada/Minor-girl-in-Vijaywada-sexually-abused-3-held/articleshow/48132614.cms

[8] http://yttoons.com/watch/KQCBnGpCR0w/sexual-harassment-by-church-father-6tv

[9] http://g-4mission.blogspot.in/2012_11_01_archive.html

[10] http://mattersindia.com/2016/02/queens-woman-shocked-vatican-reinstates-priest-who-raped-her/

“Happy to bleed” campaign, Nikita Azad and Vedaprakash – four days correspondence!

“Happy to bleed” campaign, Nikita Azad and Vedaprakash – four days correspondence!

On November 24, 2015, I came across one “Happy to bleed” campaign started by one Nikita Azad in the Facebook.

So I have gone through their column, read all the postings, comments and responses, I posted my first comment briefly as follows:

I have carefully gone through the thread. As usual, the comments have been drifting to different directions with the intruding varied opinion. The prohibition of menstruating women to enter religious places, participate in Eucharist and rituals etc., has been there throughout the world among the Jews, Christians, Muslims, Hindus and others, even today. Therefore, hope you bleed more happily and reasonably with secularism.

Very often the so-called, modern, western, progressive, broad-minded, forward-looking, feminist, and other varieties of ideologists attack Hindu religion, beliefs, etc., under the guise of attacking certain practices, where, ironically, many non-Hindus participate happily. So I started responding and replying many, where, certain specific points were raised. They again and again stressed their point of “right to bleed” etc., with photos of girls holding sanitary napkins in their hands, menstrual blood soaking their jeans, holding menstrual blood in tubes, such blood falling on fingers…….with different comments!

“GOD DO NOT LOOK BETWEEN MY LEGS OKAY” have been the words of one “Meena Kandasamy”!

“Come and see blood on my skirt”, a red banner held by two girls and some girls standing around on the road!

Are your God would be seduced by women, if they enter?

What would happen if a woman enters with a pad?

Travelling Ayyappa baktas not behaving properly with women.

Janaki Venket How many of the men going to sabarimala actually follow the rules. I have seen many flaunting it! Travelled in a train once with a bunch of these men in black dress ogling at the ladies, passing comments & drinking in the night!

 ………………

I pointed out the propaganda of Muslims there proclaiming that Islam treats women ….gives rights and so on. When pointed out, in the context of menstruation, Islam does not allow women inside mosques, then, some accepted and retracted. Nikita also accepted mentioning my name and declared that they also against Islam, as they are involved in genital mutilation etc.

Two Sikhs holding placards also supported. I asked, “Tell me honestly, whether menstruating women are allowed in the Harmandarsahib”, they did not reply, but, some women responded, and clarified that the point is not that menstruating women are allowed inside mosques of Gurudwaras, but the entry of such women inside temples! So in India, though, women talk about the rights of women etc., they worry about Hindu women only in this way and they do not bother about non-Hindu women like Muslims, Christians, Sikhs etc.!

However, she could relish with my responses and answers and therefore, come out as follows:

Friends, this is an IMPORTANT statement. Many people are continuously trying to defame the campaign by irresponsibly raising religious quarrels, even after we have repeatedly clarified that we oppose all religions, and practices that discriminate on gender grounds. When we openly posted that we are against Muslim communities that practice female genital mutilation, and do not let men and women pray together, the Brahaminical fundamentalists chose another method of maligning the campaign. They started using patriarchal words like ‘decency’ ‘decorum’ etc and even said that ‘have your mothers seen these posts’, which actually clarifies that their agenda is not to have any positive discussion, but defame the campaign. These fanatics simply cannot accept that women have spoken up in whatever manner they find correct. They wish to dictate in the manner of protest also. Also, these indiviuals have gone to the extreme, and called our activists as prostitutes, that we should be gang raped, that’s what we are good for, and must remain in kitchens. With only one day left for the social media campaign, we reject such irresponsible criticism, and urge everybody to share this message widely. Because till now we have launched a social media campaign only, and we are gifted with threats like stated, who knows what will happen when we take ground campaign. BUT AT THE SAME TIME, I APPEAL TO ALL OUR SUPPORTERS NOT TO USE ANY OFFENSIVE WORD AGAINST THE TEMPLE OR AUTHORITIES, RATHER GIVE THEM IDEOLOGICAL FIGHT WITH YOUR ARGUMENTS. That will actually improve the campaign

Though, many things were not related to me, I responded point by point as follows:

As I have already mentioned that I have been reading your campaign column and responding not only to you, but also other campaigners. Through this comments, as you have unnecessarily have indulged in slandering me, through your remarks, “the Brahaminical fundamentalists chose another method of maligning the campaign. They started using patriarchal words like ‘decency’ ‘decorum’ etc and even said that ‘have your mothers seen these posts’”, I have to point out the following facts: 1.       The so-called “religious quarrels” have been going on in your campaign carried on by your Christian and Muslim friends, as could be noted from their accusing one particular religion, while appreciating their religious “goodness” and all (in fact, they are false, untruth and myth). 2.      “we have repeatedly clarified that we oppose all religions, and practices that discriminate on gender grounds”, bogey has come out now, obviously, as I started responding to those campaigners and you have also realized mentioning my name specifically in your reply. Ironically, now you want to “bleed with secularism”! 3.      which actually clarifies that their agenda is not to have any positive discussion, but defame the campaign – As you, including all your campaigners, have indulged in such denigrating, disparaging with indecent depiction, portrayal of women etc., your are now trying to defend yourself, by saying all these things. 4.      any positive discussion – Perhaps, it is me who initiated positive discussion and that is why you have realized your mistake of attacking “one particular religion” and started, “we also condemn muslims……………………….” and so on. You also referred to my name in one discussion about “menstruating women entering mosques……………” 5.      These fanatics simply cannot accept that women have spoken up in whatever manner they find correct – what is this? What right you have to call me “brahmanical fundamentalist”, “fanatics” etc? a.      What is your agenda? b.      If you do not have guts to respond the points raised me, accept your inefficiency or yur ignorance about the subject matter discussed. c.       Do not indulge in this type of attack. d.      In fact, you get exposed yourself, the language you have been using. 6.      started using patriarchal words like ‘decency’ ‘decorum’ etc – Yes, I recorded as follows: “I am 65, with much anxiety only I have been responding to you and your friends of this campaigning. You could note that I have been pointing the facts about ‘menstruating women entering the places of worship’. But you have decided to attack only Sabarimalai movement. Moreover, when the reporters ask such mischievous questions as to how you check the women entering, only he responded. Perhaps, you might have known about the case of Jaymala actress who entered the temple. Today, internet is viewed by children, boys and girls therefore, definitely, some amount of decency and decorum is required in depicting pictorially or otherwise. 7.      Though the other comments are not directed against me, Also, these indiviuals have gone to the extreme, and called our activists as prostitutes, that we should be gang raped, that’s what we are good for, and must remain in kitchens”…………., etc, I want to point out, that Newtons’s third law only worked here! To cite one example, that photo “GOD DO NOT LOOK BETWEEN MY LEGS OKAY” 8.     I APPEAL TO ALL OUR SUPPORTERS NOT TO USE ANY OFFENSIVE WORD AGAINST THE TEMPLE OR AUTHORITIES, RATHER GIVE THEM IDEOLOGICAL FIGHT WITH YOUR ARGUMENTS – so now, you say this! But your entire campaign has been against the temple, temple authorities, customs and practices, beliefs etc. So now you are afraid of some legal action for your defaming, disparaging, denigrating……………..campaign? 9.      Oh campaigners, be calm, relaxed and thing about everything.  I hope most of you are young girls and women studying in schools and colleges with a lot of hopes and ambitions in your minds. So concentrate in your studies, instead of indulging in such campaigns, as such acts would make you imbibed wih ideology, as prompted by Nikita Azad – RATHER GIVE THEM IDEOLOGICAL FIGHT WITH YOUR ARGUMENTS. That will actually improve the campaign. 10.  So, now only after all drum-beating, she has realized that, “That will actually improve the campaign.” Great on Friday, that is the last day of your campaign. I wish MOTHER GODDESS would bless all of you with all prosperity and good future! Vedaprakash 27-11-2015.

For this, she could not respond, but, banned me from participating in the campaign expressing views, questioning their way and methodology of the campaign. So, this has become my last response.

Ironically, they talk about rights of freedom of thinking, expression, speech and so on, but when others come to think, express or talk, they ban!

What type of attitude is this?

Is this, the way of having dialogue or group discussion?

Is this the mode of exhibiting their tolerance?

I understand that she has extended the campaign till December 4, 2015!

Vedaprakash

30-11-2015.

Hindu Temples of Tamilnadu under systematic destruction!

Hindu Temples of Tamilnadu under systematic destruction!

T. S. Subramanian has pointed out the deteriorating condition of murals in temples many times[1]. He should be congratulated to bring out such facts with concerned feelings expressed in his writings. However, the concerned and connected people have not taken any action to annul such vandalizing processes going on in the name of renovation, administration and other actions. The recent article “Targets of destruction” has been provoking, but we have to wait and see the response of the authorities.

Target of destruction: He starts with the appropriate beginning[2]: “Art, in more than 50 temples and three palaces in Tamil Nadu, is being mutilated” and explains the condition as follows: “Temples in Tamil Nadu are repositories of history, with inscriptions, sculptures, murals, bronzes, carvings, architecture and so on. The inscriptions provide valuable insights into the history of the period during which the temples were built, the village administration that prevailed, elections conducted for its assemblies, taxes collected, boards set up for the maintenance of lakes, ponds and canals, donation of land for Brahmin settlements, gifting gold for temple maintenance, etc.  There are more than 50 temples and three palaces in Tamil Nadu with murals. The palaces are Ramalinga Vilasam in Ramanathapuram and those at Bodinayakanur near Madurai and Padmanabhapuram in Kanyakumari district. While just four or five temples have murals dating back to the Pallava period (seventh to ninth century CE) and the Chola period (10th and 11th century CE), the majority of the murals belong to the Vijayanagar and the Nayak periods (14th to 17th century CE). The Brihadeeswara temple in Thanjavur have murals belonging to the Chola, the Nayak and the Maratha reigns.

Visual archives:  The mural masterpieces are visual archives on the history of the period, coronation rituals, the dress or the jewellery that men and women of those days wore, their hairstyle, musical instruments, the battles that they fought, the weapons used and so on. There are several Jain temples that have wonderful murals based on the Jain traditions, the Tirthankaras and the Yakshis. A favourite subject of many of the artists of those times was episodes from the Ramayana and the Mahabharata, and some of the artists even took care to write the labels for the episodes (captions) in Tamil or Telugu. Unfortunately in Tamil Nadu, the murals, the inscriptions, the sculptures and carvings have become targets of destruction and vandalism. The officials of the Hindu Religious and Charitable Endowments (HR and CE) Department, who administers the temples, are to be blamed for this state. Most often, these officials fail to appreciate and preserve these splendid works due to lack of knowledge of history.

How Meenakshi Temple was targeted? In the famous Meenakshi temple, Madurai, several historic mandapams have become shopping complexes. The Pudhu mandapam, the Ashta Sakti mandapam, Veera Vasantharayar mandapam and Meenakshi Nayakar mandapam teem with hundreds of shops, obstructing from view pillars with incredibly beautiful sculptures. A scholar on the history of the Meenakshi temple was displeased that its 1,000-pillared mandapam, with superb sculptures, has become ‘a studio’ now, with an incongruously gleaming granite floor, skewed focus lights and a big sculpture of Nataraja painted in black! Several years ago, the earthen bed of the temple’s famous ‘Golden Lotus’ tank (Pottramarai Kulam) was cemented up, with the result that no water stays in the tank now and it looks barren now. The HR and CE officials of the temple also whitewashed hundreds of beautiful murals, painted on the walls of the northern corridor of the Golden Lotus tank, portraying the ‘Tiruvilaiyadal,’ in the first quarter of 1996.

In a state of disrepair: While sculptures and carvings can survive for centuries because they have been chiselled out of granite, murals are vulnerable to nature. Since these murals were painted with natural dyes on mandapam walls or ceiling, they easily lend themselves to vandalism from devotees. Besides, they are exposed to sun or seepage of water from rain. Gaps between the granite slabs that form the roof of the mandapams lead to seepage of water due to rain and the sidewalls begin to ‘sweat.’ The lime plaster which forms the base for the murals has a tendency to absorb the water. When rain water falls on the murals painted on the ceiling or walls, fungus develops and the murals start peeling off. Smoke from the camphor (lit by the devotees) and from the oil lamps damage the paintings. Besides, they suffer from desecration at the hands of the HR and CE officials and devotees. Officials have fixed scores of metres of electric wires on the murals on the walls of the mandapams, installed switch boxes and tube lights on them, as it has happened in several places on the splendid murals in the Devaraja Swamy temple at Kanchipuram, portraying the 108 Divya Desam murals.

Other examples of vandalism: Extremely rare murals painted on wood in the Tirukkutraleeswarar temple at Tirukkutrala Chitra Sabha in Tirunelveli district have been vandalised. At the Siva temple at Patteeswaram, paintings were sandblasted in 1998 in the name of cleaning the surfaces on which they were painted. The paintings portrayed Lord Siva presenting a palanquin studded with pearls to the Saivite saint Tirugnana Sambandar because he could not bear to see his devotee walking in the sun. Temple officials sandblasted another row of paintings narrating the life of a mythical king who had no child but was blessed with a child after praying to Siva at Patteeswaram. Officials of the Lakshminarasimhar temple at Sevilimedu, near Kanchipuram, whitewashed them. They do not exist today.  Tales of destruction and desecration of these invaluable murals in temples in Tamil Nadu do not end with this list. What happened to the paintings at the Meenakshi temple at Madurai, the Trilokyanatha Jaina temple at Tiruparuttikunram near Kanchipuram, another Jaina temple at Karanthai near Kanchipuram and the Ramalinga Vilasam Palace in Ramanathapuram town take the cake.

Why this targested vattcks of vandalism? What the Mohammedan and the Europeans rulers could have done during their reigns is carried on in India, that too, after “independence” by the Indians by themselves. Ironically, “Hindu Religious & Endowment Board” under the control of proclaimed atheist, rationalist and particularly anti-Hindu ideologists for the last 70 years. The staff and officers entering into the department of HR&CE have been ideologists of all sorts of such category and some non-Hindus have also been there. And this vandalism is not done on one day, but carried on systematically. Whenever any official function comes, they carry out such destruction easily under the guise of celebration. The moment the temple comes under the control of HR&CE, any official comes into a temple, an office is constructed inside temple, that office is converted into some sort of lodge and then star-type accommodation, the temples start losing their sanctity. Perhaps, God is leaving the place. Under such circumstances, these modern day vandals, ideologists and rulers start their destruction.

---

[1] http://www.thehindu.com/arts/history-and-culture/article2109633.ece?viewImage=1

http://www.thehindu.com/arts/history-and-culture/article2109633.ece?viewImage=3

http://www.thehindu.com/arts/history-and-culture/article2109633.ece?viewImage=6

[2] http://www.thehindu.com/arts/history-and-culture/article2109633.ece?homepage=true

Ramajanmabhumi-Babarimasjid, evidences and Court or Hisorians as witnesses and Sunni Wakf Board Experts!

Ramajanmabhumi-Babarimasjid, evidences and Court or

Hisorians as witnesses and Sunni Wakf Board Experts!

Vedaprakash

Ramajanmabhumi-Babarimasjid and eminent hisorians: The eminent historians would appear immediately, whenever “Rama” appears in the headlines of Indian media. They start interpreting historicity of “Ramayana” according to their own way without any regard for the other view or perspective[1]. Even in the case of Sethu-samuthram, they started writing in “the Hindu” and EPW grinding their mills as usual[2]. Of course, the left media does / did not want the opinion of the others[3]. They vociferously lecture and write that they would appeal against the judgment and so on, but disappear thereafter. They exploit every forum like IHC etc., only to project their viewpoint[4]. Romila Thapar roared, “We would appeal against this jugment”, when the so-called “Hindutva judgment” came[5], but nothing happened! And the faithful readers of “The Hindu”, Frontline, EPW and the devoted members of IHC etc., also do not bother as to why their eminent historians tell lies or play such dubious games? Why they believe the eminent historians, because of their eminence or for their duplicity? Have they ever thought about them as to why they behave like that? Now, again these left / eminent intellectuals / historians have been busy with issuing statements. Besides, historians and experts others too join!

130 experts sign – ASI report should be made public, says appeal to Chief Justice[6] (14-10-2010): Now 130 experts have come out with an open letter addressed to the Chief Justice of India! The news reports say like this, “The Allahabad High Court based a significant part of its judgment in the Ayodhya case on the evidence provided by the Archaeological Survey of India’s report on its excavations at the site, submitted to the court in 2003. They accuse that the report is still hidden from the public eye, and a virtual gag order placed on archaeologists who acted as observers during the excavation[7]. Now that the judgment has been pronounced, a group of 130 academics, activists and intellectuals have demanded that the ASI report be published. In an open letter[8] to the Chief Justice of India and the Chief Justice of the Allahabad High Court, they urged that the report “be made available for scrutiny in the public domain, especially to scholars, as it is now a part of the public judicial record.” The ASI report, which concluded that a temple had existed at the site, has been criticised by many archaeologists for ignoring evidence such as animal bones, which would not have been found in a temple for Ram, and the existence of glazed pottery and graves at all levels which indicated Muslim residence”[9].

Shereen Ratnagar and D. Mandal were slapped with contempt of court charges by the Allahabad High Court: “In May, archaeologists Shereen Ratnagar and D. Mandal were slapped with contempt of court charges by the Allahabad High Court for sharing their observations in a book, titled “Ayodhya: Archaeology After Excavation”, published by Tulika in 2007. The orders in that case have been reserved”. That means they know the implications of the law. That is why they have been keeping quite since 2003!

The open letter and signatories: “The open letter notes that, “the world at large is equally constrained to silence. Such a judicially ordained zone of uncertainty curbs freedom of expression and fair comment.” Indians have never seen them in other caes where such issues have been involved. Thus, they want to selective!

Signatories: “The letter was signed by well-known Indian academics such as Sumit Sarkar, Uma Chakravarti, K.N. Pannikkar, K. Satchidanandan, Ajay Dandekar and filmmakers such as Anand Patwardhan, as well as less well-known Indian citizens – a software engineer, a textile design consultant, a teacher[10]. Academics from abroad – including those from universities in London, Chicago, Stockholm and Copenhagen – have also signed the letter, as friends of India”. This type of letters have been issued since 1992 and many times, the so-called signatories say that they have simply agreed to include their names in such letters. In some cases, they did / do not know also about the inclusion of their names!

Romila Thapar and others: Statement issued through Sahamat (01-10-2010): Another report goes like this: “Questioning the verdict of the Allahabad High Court on the Ram Janmabhoomi-Babri Masjid title suits, a group of left-leaning intellectuals on Friday said the judgment was “yet another blow to the secular fabric of the country” and the “repute of our judiciary”.  The scholars, including Romila Thapar, K M Shrimali, K N Pannikar, Irfan Habib, Utsa Patnaik and C P Chandrasekhar, said in a statement through the platform of Safdar Hashmi Memorial Trust (SAHMAT) that the verdict had raised “serious concerns” because of the way history, reason and secular values had been treated in it. “The view that the Babri Masjid was built at the site of a Hindu temple, which has been maintained by two of the three judges, takes no account of all the evidence contrary to this fact turned up by the Archaeological Survey of India’s own excavations — the presence of animal bones throughout as well as the use of ‘surkhi’ and lime mortar (all characteristic of Muslim presence) rule out the possibility of a Hindu temple having been there beneath the mosque,” the statement noted.

The verdict on Ayodhya: a historian’s perspective[11] (01-10-2010): Under this caption, the view of romila thapar appeared in “The Hindu”. It goes like this, “It has annulled respect for history and seeks to replace it with religious faith.

“The verdict is a political judgment and reflects a decision which could as well have been taken by the state years ago. Its focus is on the possession of land and the building a new temple to replace the destroyed mosque. The problem was entangled in contemporary politics involving religious identities but also claimed to be based on historical evidence. This latter aspect has been invoked but subsequently set aside in the judgment.

“The court has declared that a particular spot is where a divine or semi-divine person was born and where a new temple is to be built to commemorate the birth. This is in response to an appeal by Hindu faith and belief[12]. Given the absence of evidence in support of the claim, such a verdict is not what one expects from a court of law. Hindus deeply revere Rama as a deity but can this support a legal decision on claims to a birth-place, possession of land and the deliberate destruction of a major historical monument to assist in acquiring the land?

“The verdict claims that there was a temple of the 12th Century AD at the site which was destroyed to build the mosque — hence the legitimacy of building a new temple.

“The excavations of the Archaeological Survey of India (ASI) and its readings have been fully accepted even though these have been strongly disputed by other archaeologists and historians. Since this is a matter of professional expertise on which there was a sharp difference of opinion the categorical acceptance of the one point of view, and that too in a simplistic manner, does little to build confidence in the verdict. One judge stated that he did not delve into the historical aspect since he was not a historian but went to say that history and archaeology were not absolutely essential to decide these suits! Yet what are at issue are the historicity of the claims and the historical structures of the past one millennium.

“A mosque built almost 500 years ago and which was part of our cultural heritage[13] was destroyed wilfully by a mob urged on by a political leadership. There is no mention in the summary of the verdict that this act of wanton destruction, and a crime against our heritage, should be condemned. The new temple will have its sanctum — the presumed birthplace of Rama — in the area of the debris of the mosque. Whereas the destruction of the supposed temple is condemned and becomes the justification for building a new temple, the destruction of the mosque is not, perhaps by placing it conveniently outside the purview of the case.

“Has created a precedent[14]: The verdict has created a precedent in the court of law that land can be claimed by declaring it to be the birthplace of a divine or semi-divine being worshipped by a group that defines itself as a community. There will now be many such janmasthans wherever appropriate property can be found or a required dispute manufactured. Since the deliberate destruction of historical monuments has not been condemned what is to stop people from continuing to destroy others? The legislation of 1993 against changing the status of places of worship has been, as we have seen in recent years, quite ineffective.

“What happened in history, happened. It cannot be changed[15]. But we can learn to understand what happened in its fuller context and strive to look at it on the basis of reliable evidence. We cannot change the pas[16]t to justify the politics of the present. The verdict has annulled respect for history and seeks to replace history with religious faith. True reconciliation can only come when there is confidence that the law in this country bases itself not just on faith and belief, but on evidence”.

Earlier stand – Irfan Habib (01-10-2010): “With the three judges pronouncing differing opinions on the historical and archaeological aspects of the case in the Allahabad High Court’s judgement on the disputed land in Ayodhya, many leading historians have been left bemused. “It’s not a logical judgement with so many parts going 2-1. One does not accept the logicality of the judgement,” said Irfan Habib, a noted historian and a former Chairman of the Indian Council of Historical Research who earlier taught at the Aligarh Muslim University. He noted that the verdict seemed to legitimise the events of 1949[17], when an idol was placed inside the mosque, by constant references. On the other hand, by minimising any mentions of the demolition of the Babri Masjid in 1992, the court seemed to be disregarding it, he said. He also expressed surprise that two judges questioned the date of construction of the Babri Masjid, as well as the involvement of emperor Babar or his commander Mir Baqi, since there had been clear inscriptions to this effect before the demolition. “Things that are totally clear historically, the court has tried to muddy,” he said[18].

D. N. Jha: “The historical evidence has not been taken into account,” said D.N. Jha, history professor at the Delhi University. Noting the judgement’s mention of the “faith and belief of Hindus” in reference to the history of the disputed structure, Dr. Jha asked why the court had requested an excavation of the site.“If it is a case of ‘belief,’ then it becomes an issue of theology, not archaeology. Should the judiciary be deciding cases on the basis of theology is a question that needs to be asked,” he said.

Supriya Verma, one of the observers: Professional archaeologists also noted that the judges did not seem to rely heavily on the Archaeological Survey of India’s court-directed excavation of the site in 2003, at least in the summaries of their verdict available on Thursday evening. “Somewhere, there is doubt about the credibility of that report,” said Supriya Verma of the Jawaharlal Nehru University, who acted as an observer during the ASI excavation. She noted that neither Justice Sudhir Agarwal nor Justice Dharam Veer Sharma even referenced the ASI report to support his conclusion on the existence of a temple on the site before the mosque was built. “It is almost as though they themselves were not convinced by the evidence. They are clearly conceding that there was no archaeological evidence of a temple or of its demolition…It is a judgement of theology,” she said.

Jaya Menon, one of the observers: Another observer of the ASI excavation, Jaya Menon of the Aligarh Muslim University, noted that the ASI report itself did not provide any evidence of a demolition, and only asserted the existence of a temple in its conclusion. “So I don’t know on what basis they made their judgements,” she said. The ASI report had been criticised by many archaeologists for ignoring evidence such as animal bones, which would not have been found in a temple for Ram, and the existence of glazed pottery and graves which indicated Muslim residents.

The eminent historians as witnesses of Muslims in the Allahabad case: The eminent historians, historical experts  and leftist manufacturers never bother about their secular credentials.  It is not known as to why these coteries should always support for the Masjid or Muslim cause. Ironically, the following have been the witnesses of the case in question, which is criticised by them:

Sl.No	Witness no	Name of the witness
1	Witness No. 63	R.S. Sharma
2	Witness No. 64	Suraj Bhan
3	Witness No. 65	D.N. Jha[19]
4	Witness No. 66	Romila Thapar
5	Witness No. 70	Irfan Habib
6	Witness No. 72	B.N. Pandey
7	Witness No. 95	K.M. Shrimali
8	Witness No. 99	Satish Chandra
9	Witness No. 102	Gyanendra Pandey

Then, where is their loci standi in criticising the judgment and Court? As witnesses, definitely, they could have deposed before the judges presenting their “historical facts” as they only know how to interpret! The public perhaps, even today do not know that in secular India, these historians stood witnesses to the Muslims! Why none has appeared for Hindus or temple cause? When the cold-blooded terrorist and heinous killer like Kasab is given legal aid, why none appeared for the non-Muslim and non-mosque group? Where is secularism? Would they come out in the public what they told to the judges in the Court? However, the poor show showed in the court by them raises many questions.

HC judge exposed experts espousing Masjids cause: Waqf Board Line-Up Accused Of Having Ostrich-Like Attitude:  The role played by independent experts, historians and archaeologists who appeared on behalf of the Waqf Board to support its claim has come in for criticism by one Allahabad High Court judge in the Ayodhya verdict. While the special bench of three judges unanimously dismissed objections raised by the experts to the presence of a temple, it was Justice Sudhir Agarwal who put their claims to extended judicial scrutiny. Most of these experts deposed twice. Before the ASI excavations, they said there was no temple beneath the mosque and, after the site had been dug up,they claimed what was unearthed was a mosque or a stupa. During lengthy cross-examination spread over several pages and recorded by Justice Agarwal, the historians and experts were subjected to pointed queries about their expertise, background and basis for their opinions.
To the courts astonishment, some who had written signed articles and issued pamphlets, were withering under scrutiny and the judge said they were displayed an ostrich-like attitude to facts. He also pointed out how the independent witnesses were connected one had done a PhD under the other, another had contributed an article to a book penned by a witness.

The vociverous historians could not give evidences properly as witnesses with all their extertise[20]: Some instances underlined by the judge are[21]:

• Suvira Jaiswal[22] deposed whatever knowledge I gained with respect to disputed site is based on newspaper reports or what others told (other experts). She said she prepared a report on the Babri dispute on basis of discussions with medieval history expert in my department.

• Supriya Verma[23], another expert who challenged the ASI excavations, had not read the ground penetration radar survey report that led the court to order an excavation. She did her PhD under another expert Shireen F Ratnagar.

• Verma and Jaya Menon[24] alleged that pillar bases at the excavated site had been planted but HC found they were not present at the time the actual excavation took place.

• Archaeologist Shereen F Ratnagar has written the introduction to the book of another expert who deposed, Professor Mandal. She admitted she had no field experience.

Normally, courts do not make adverse comments on the deposition of a witness and suffice it to consider whether it is credible or not, but we find it difficult to resist ourselves in this particular case considering the sensitivity and nature of dispute and also the reckless and irresponsible kind of statements…[25] the judge noted. He said opinions had been offered without making a proper investigation, research or study in the subject. The judge said he was startled and puzzled by contradictory statements.When expert witness Suraj Bhan deposed on the Babri mosque, the weight of his evidence was contradicted by anotherexpert for Muslim parties, Shirin Musavi, who told the court that Bhan is an archaeologist and not an expert on medieval history[26]. Justice Agarwal noted that instead of helping in making a cordial atmosphere it tends to create more complications, conflict and controversy. He pointed out that experts carry weight with public opinion.

When the matter is subjudice, one has to obey law: It is a simple matter that whenever, any issue / case is pending with the Court, as the matter is subjudice, it should not be discussed or the decisions cannot be drawn in favour of anybody. However, these left historians etc., have been always speaking and writing supporting for Muslim cause or against Hindus, as is evident from their own recorded / printed statements / articles always published in the selected in few journals / ndewspapers. Unfortunately, they have even agreed to be witnesses for the Wakf Board in the Allahabad Court as their names are figuring. Ironivcally, they are called as Sunni Wakf Board experts![27]

When religions rely upon belief system, so also secularism historians too belive so ignoring objectivity: Like believers and dis-believers historians too believe and compel others to believe their perspective without any objectivity. As their objectivity differes, their perspective also differ, but try to argue with ideology, as could be understood by others. With belief system, no two ideologists could come together; with objectivity no two historians could accept the same historical event in the same view or pwerspective; here, the media has been projecting only one view. So what about the other view and why the media does not provide opportunity to accommodate their view? Should “audi alteram partem – hear the other side and decide” be applicable only to the Courts according to the principle of natural justice or the historians do not want to follow?

The same pattern as noted in the case of DK, DMK and other rapid atheists and radical experts is noted in the case of these eminent historians or Sunni Wakf Board experts: As it is pointed out in the case of DK[28]-DMK[29] radicals and rabid atheist groups that they do not come to Courts or face courts, though, they used to cry and roar that they are not afraid of Courts and so on. Here, also, suppressing the facts, these historians talk and write one thing in the dailies and cover up their mumbling and bungling in the court. The court recordings of the witnesses have been actually exposing their hollowness of expertise, deceptiveness of historical knowledge and their dubious role as witnesses. That they accuse even without seeing, even without reading or just discussing with others etc, prove their capacity of manoeuvring and manipulation of academics. How they get PhDs etc., only prove such academic degradation and professional pampering without any shame or remorse. It is open secret that the JNU, AMU, DU, IHC, ICHR and others at one side and BMAC, Sunni Wakf Board, AIMPLB at the other side have been playing communalism under the guise of secularism. Just by accusing others they cannot live, survive and continue their careers in this competitive world.

Why the eminent historians and Sunni Wakf Board experts did not respond to the remarks of the Judge? Definitely, the remarks of the Judge have been questioning the integrity of the eminent historians and Sunni Wakf Board experts, who deposed before the court as witnesses! They cannot simply brush aside such exposure, as it casts aspersion on their position. The English reading Indians and Indian students may doubt their veracity, reliability and uprightness, as they read their writings or listen to them. Therefore, they should go to court to clear the mess instead of shooting out letters to the Chief Justice just like politicians.

Indians and Indian youth should note as to whether these Sunni Board experts should teach history. Very often, it is said, claimed and propagated that India is / has been secular. Yes, how then the eminent historians professional archaeologists acted as Sunni Wakf Board experts and deposed as witnesses to the Muslims? Why these retired historians, senile professors and their working agents always make clamor about history, historicity and historiography in India, as if they are the sole selling agents of such stuff? Nowadays, the fact is that a few have been takers for history and most of the universities have dispensed with history subject. Definitely, the so-called historians have lost their importance and thus they tried to struggle for survival with the political and communal support. Now, the documents are available to all and the facts are known to everybody who access them through internet or otherwise. Common people may not know or understand the deceptive talkings and writings of the eminent historians or Sunni Wakf Board experts, but slowly they come to know. They easily understand that who want to settle the dispute and who want to continue the dispute for their stakes. Definitely, Muslims and Hindus want to settle the issue once for all, but these history gamblers and politicians want to continue. Therefore, the will of people prevail.

Vedaprakash

16-10-2010

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[1] Vedaprakash, Historians: Mythistory, Historical myths and Historiography in India , http://indiainteracts.wordpress.com/2009/07/16/historians-mythistory-historical-myths-and-historiography-in-india/

[2] Romila Thapar, “Where fusion cannot work – faith and history” (the Hindu, dated September 28, 2007).

…………………., Historical Memory without History, in Economic and Political weekly, VOL 42 No. 39 September 29 – October 05, 2007, pp.3903-3905.

K. N. Panikkar, Myth, history and politics, Frontline, October 5, 2007, pp.21-24.

Suraj Bhan, “Government should have stood by ASI”, Ibid, pp.19-20.

[3] Vedaprakash, History, faith and Indian historians A rejoinder to Romila Thapar. , http://indiainteracts.wordpress.com/2009/07/16/history-faith-and-indian-historians-a-rejoinder-to-romila-thapar/

Vedaprakash, A rejoinder to Romila Thapar for her another version appearing under the caption, “Historical Memory without History” Economic and Political Weekly , http://indiainteracts.wordpress.com/2009/07/16/a-rejoinder-to-romila-thapar-for-her-another-version-appearing-under-the-caption-%E2%80%9Chistorical-memory-without-history%E2%80%9D-economic-and-political-weekly/

[4] During the 2007-IHC session, Suvira Jaiswal was making such satatements. Then, in Delhi also they tried take up the matter. Now, in February 2011 at Malda, they may raise the issue. However, the Indians have to weait and see.

[5] In “the Hindu”, as usual, the news appeared with her photo and all, but after that everbody would have forgot about it! However, their warrior-like talk, veiled threatening and tactics of suppression of facts cannot be acquired by others.

[6] The Hindu, ASI report should be made public, says appeal to Chief Justice, Published: October 14, 2010 01:54 IST | Updated: October 14, 2010 02:03 IST; http://www.hindu.com/2010/10/14/stories/2010101464751800.htm

[7] How this has been a blatant lie has been exposed by the judge and that is why these guys have now tried to save their image by writing such letters. Of course, the media gives due publicity to such hypes and gimmicks.

[8] However, their mumbling, jumbling and bungling deposes before the Court have been kept as closed secret!

[9] Thus the eminent historians look for a non-vegetarian kitchen of Muslims there instrad of a temple. The same experts declared that the 16” inscription was planted by the Karsevaks in 1992.

[10] When Bharatiya Itihasa Sankalana Samiti works on the same lines, the same eminent historians make fun of having such diversified experts, but now they themselves have such signatories, just to project their strength.

[11] The Hindu, Published: October 2, 2010 00:41 IST | Updated: October 2, 2010.

[12] There is nothing new in Romila’s argument, as she repeats the same matter again and again. The unfortunate thing is that she like her friends always want others should accept their views!

[13] How they contradict in their views legally can be noted in such statements. When convenience comes, they forget law, when law is against them, they start talking generalization or raise the bogey of “Hindutva”!

[14] Law precedence is created in the Court. Yes, definitely, the judges are the persons to create and others have to accept. Of course, the appealable legal remedy is there.

[15] But whatever happened also cannot be forgotten. When the same historians want to whitewash the temple destruction of the Muslims and accept only the Muslim contribution, such type of exclusivist logic is not explained. Why the students should not know the facts? In law it is said audi alteram partem – hear the other side and decide. How then historians want to decide without knowing the other side?

[16] Why then the interpretation of the past is always different for different historians? Nowadays, historians do not want objectivity also. How then they woerry about accuracy, when they themselves are not worried about it?

[17] Acts and Rules are within the time frame work. All know that Places of Worship Act is there and it e3xempts only this place and not others. Why then they talk about pre-1947 and after 1947, when law its4elf  cannot do so?

[18]The Hindu, Historical evidence ignored, say historians, dated October 1, 2010, http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/article805087.ece

[19] http://www.hinduonnet.com/fline/stories/20101022272113200.htm

[20] http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/How-Allahabad-HC-exposed-experts-espousing-Masjid-cause/articleshow/6716643.cms

[21] http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/politics/nation/How-Allahabad-HC-exposed-experts-espousing-Masjid-cause/articleshow/6718053.cms

[22] http://www.hindu.com/2007/03/13/stories/2007031304891300.htm

[23] It is interesting to note that the ASI report talks about a shrine followed by a temple with different structural phases, it also talks of “animal bones recovered from various levels of different periods”. If any shrine and a temple existed how can anyone account for the animal bones, Supriya Verma asks? She also maintains that stones and decorated bricks could have been used in any building, not necessarily only in a temple. Also, the carved architectural members have come from the debris and not from the stratified context.

[24] She got appointment in the AMU after she started supporting the cause of mosque and appeared as Sunni Wakf Board expert!

[25] The historians who deposed as witnesses and as well as others should carefully read this and understand their postion. They cannot pretend as if nothing happened or pose as great authorities and roam here and there in historical forums and conferences. Now Indians have also understood their double-games, double-speak and double-standards.

[26] Nowadays, just like medical experts or specialized doctors, these historians ad archaeologists trading charges like this – so-and-so is an expert in that field and he alone can know the truth and others cannot know the truth. Such type of exclusive mind-set exposes their arrogance and weakness and not the real expertise.

[27]Asghar ali Engineer, Archaeological Excavations and Temple, September 1-15, 2003,  http://www.csss-isla.com/arch%20150.htm

[28] Vedaprakash, Old Judgments and  New thoughts in the present context: S. Veerabadran Chettiar vs E. V. Ramaswami Naicker  others., http://vedaprakash.indiainteracts.in/2008/08/09/old-judgments-and-new-thoughts-in-the-present-context-s-veerabadran-chettiar-vs-e-v-ramaswami-naicker-others/

[29] Karunanidhi has been involved in many cases, but, he has been circumventing them in different ways. In other words, he does not have any guts to face the Court!

http://dravidianatheism.wordpress.com/2010/05/16/%E0%AE%AA%E0%AF%86%E0%AE%B0%E0%AE%BF%E0%AE%AF%E0%AE%BE%E0%AE%B0%E0%AF%8D-%E0%AE%AE%E0%AF%81%E0%AE%A4%E0%AE%B2%E0%AF%8D-%E0%AE%95%E0%AE%B0%E0%AF%81%E0%AE%A3%E0%AE%BE%E0%AE%A8%E0%AE%BF%E0%AE%A4%E0%AE%BF/

Atheist’s sermon on Ramayana!

Atheist’s sermon on Ramayana!

Three years back, I started blogging here, but, I switched over to http://www.indiainteracts.com. However, as they stopped such facility suddenly, many of my writings, blogging, comments etc., disappeared. Therefore, I just want to revive, recollect and repost them, wherever possible. This response was actually for one Nandivarman of Pondicherry, as he used to attack Hindus with his self-claimed atheism and so on.

My attention is drawn to your posting in WordPress.com.

I offer my comments to your post:

“India was an island nation surrounded by seas hence it had the name நாவலந் தீவு”.

Is to so? Kindly tell me, where the expression “நாவலந் தீவு” is found in the ancient Tamil literature or “Sangam” literature?

“In such a scenario to claim that a Land Bridge built 1,750.000 years ago when no human being had inhabited the Earth”

In haste, you are mentioning as 1,750 years (1,750.000 = 1750).

Paula Richman wrote a book titled “Many Ramayanas” Yes the question before us is to accept which Ramayana as true story?.

You claimed youself as a rationalist / atheist etc. Then, you have to be careful in quoting from secondary sources, because, non-Hindus or anti-Hindus can write anything and quoting such biased ideas make you unbecoming of a “rationalist / atheist”. You should have read H. D. Sankalia also before jumping into the so-called “debate”.

Your mention about Jain / Buddha Ramayanas: As Ramayana has become so popular, even Jains and Buddhists had to imitate Ramayana by changing the story, just like Kulandai. Therefore, there is nothing new in it. As a researcher or scholar or historian, you have to demythologize and find out the truth, instead of relying upon “such myth on myth”, straightaway.

[The biblical Adam and Eve’s story and its resemblance could also be taken note of] Sita becoming a monkey after eating a fruit: This shows that either you have not read the story properly or misquoting or rather drawing a wrong parallel with the biblical Adam and Eve (don’t try to escape by telling that I am a rationalist and all). I do not know as to whether Eve became monkey to have such forceful comparison!

You furthering the above story: Here, you are perhaps nearing the biblical fables, as Jesus also reportedly married to Mary Magdelene. Perhaps, you decided to not stretch it.

According to Thais, Hanuman had many affairs and children: Naturally, if the wishes are horses, even blind can fly. Why Thais, even Anna did it. As you are a rationalist and atheist, you quote all these things, so enjoy.

Anna’s inconclusive debate on Kamba Ramayanam: “Navalar Somasundara Bharathiar and சொல்லின் செல்வர் R.P.Sethu Pillai debated with Anna and openly admitted they have lost the debate. This debate in Tamil Book “Let Fire Spread” தீ பரவட்டும் wants to illuminate Tamil hearts by symbolically burning Kamba ramayanam. Pulavar Kuzhanthai wrote இராவண காவியம். Ravana Kavyam  can be considered as Dravidian version of Ramayanam”.No, they were ashamed of the perversity and vulgarity erupted in the name of literary flow and hanged their heads. Any Tamil knowing or reading person would hang his head after reading as it is just like “yellow journalism” circulated under the “Dravidian” banner, that too, coming from Anna, who became Chief Minister of Tamilnadu taking oath under the Indian Constitution, that has been written by Ambedkar. Anyway, the facts are as follows:

• The so-called debate was held in the auditorium of Law College, Madras on 09-02-1943 under Ramachandra Chettiyar.
• Anna started speaking and took more than one and half hours leaving no time to others.
• Pointing out the falsehood in his speech, R. P. Sethu Pillai openly spoke about his weakness in the argument. In fact, re ridiculed Anna for quoting from “Northern Nehru”, being a “Nakkiran” (one who always finds fault with others). Regretting that he could not speak for a long time, he wound up his speech within ten minutes. He dared him that he would even come to Kanchipuram for another debate on the subject matter, if he would invite him.
• Ezattu Adigal, who followed him, was asked to cut short his speech within five minutes.
• Then Srinivasan started speaking, but he was prevented from speaking, as the DK activists created a riot-like condition. He had to stop his speech, because of the pandemonium created by them.
• But, Anna was given a chance to speak again!
• So that was the debate conducted with “freedom of speech” and respect for speakers!
• However, winding up, C. M. Ramachandra Chetti concluded that he could not give his opinion, as the debate had been inconclusive.

The main point discussed was as to whether Ravana was an Aryan or Dravidian. Thus, the first debate had been the most undemocratic conducted under controlled conditions with rioters.

The second debate was conducted on 14-03-1943 at Devanga Padasalai, Sevvaipettai,  Salem. Salem College A. Ramasamy presided over Anna and Somasundara Bharathi spoke.

• Anna spoke as usual taking full time

• Somasundara Bharathi pointed out that Anna spoke as an orator with brimming emotion, not as a debater. He then, however, brought out his points refuting Anna;s talk.

• He left, as his speech was over and moreover, he had to catch his train, as planned by the organizers.

• But, after his departure, Anna was given a chance and he stressed upon Ravana’s race and concluded with the demand of burning “scriptures of Aryans”.

• A. Ramasamy, though did not give any result about the debate, he pointed out that there was “vulgarity” in Kamba Ramayanam.

In any case, such diverted reference has nothing to do with the “Ramar’s Palam”.

“The question before us which of these versions is based on true historical facts. These are not days where everyone will accept anything with blind faith. If you place new facts to reopen a settled issue in history, you should place facts and prove it”.

Yes, yes. Nowadays, everybody can get information easily and they decide about truth behind it.  Even in those days (when Anna debated), the other scholars were not allowed to speak or threatened with dire consequences. In other words, they used their own type of terrorism in those days. Now, let us see, how truth is faced.

“Let us examine the falsehoods one by one. We from the Dravidian Movement are atheists but not Ravana; all know that Ravana as per epics is a devotee of Lord Siva. The doubt which arises to me is why should a reincarnation of God perform superhuman deeds to impress demigods? Does it mean that Demigods are more powerful than the Original God on reincarnation?”

Interestingly, the answer is there in the so-called above debate, as they debated only about the race of Ravana as to whether he was an Aryan or Dravidian! Rationalist or atheist has to deny such a myth. Having believed it as a myth, why one should worry about it as to whether it works or not? Without the Ramayana myth, there is no Ravana. If Ramayana is a myth, Ravana is also a myth. Then, why debate about his “racist credentials”?

“There are many books on the Indian Ocean. All these books give us evidences on the continental drift, the submerged lands of the Lemuria, which Tamils prefer to call as the Kumari Kandam”.

Yes, but note again, the western scholars do not believe in such hypotheses. Why them, even Indian eminent historians not only do not accept, but also dub them as myth.

Nandi Varman, go to Endo-Eurasian group and other forums, where Tamil literature is misinterpreted and disrespected. Steve Farmer openly accuses that your friend R. Mathivanan is a foregerer. They go on debate even without knowing the fundamentals of Tamil and Tamil literature. I feel it is better to spend your energy there instead of politicizing the issue.

VEDAPRAKASH,

Researcher,

Chennai.

vedamvedaprakash@yahoo.com